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Jon Tillman

Exactamundo! In my personal religion, you're not a success until you can say "I can't believe they pay me for this!"

Alexander Kjerulf

I agree completely Fred, the pursuit of money is hollow and ultimately fruitless, and it's a crying shame that so much energy is put into collecting money.

Two things sprang to mind when I read your post:
1: The ancient greeks measured a man's wealth not by how much he had but by how much he gave away. The more you gave to the temples, the poor or your friends, family and city, the richer you were.

2: Even when you're following your passion, you're still responsible for every choice you make along the way. And if those choices lead you to bankruptcy, well, they're still your choices. It's not the fault of your passion.

How do you know that you're following your passion? When you can fail at it and still say "OK, I failed but it was worth it."

And that's another good definition of success.

There's also this quote from one of Douglas Adams' Hitchhiker books:
[Our planet] has - or rather had - a problem, which was this: most of the people living on it were unhappy for pretty much of the time. Many solutions were suggested for this problem, but most of these were largely concerned with the movements of small green pieces of paper, which is odd because on the whole it wasn't the small green pieces of paper that were unhappy.

Scott Young

Excellent points!

My favorite quote about money:

"Money makes an excellent servant but a brutal and horrible master."

Jesse Skinner

Great point.. I often read and think about "what to do with my life" stuff, and the common answer is "do whatever makes you happy". But there is an important distinction here.

A gambling addict loves to gamble. A drug addict loves to get fucked up. An alcoholic loves to get drunk. And in the short term, these things really do make a person happy. But certainly not in the long term. I guess it's not as simple as "happiness".

And this is even a kind of contradiction with the value that the journey is more important than the destination. I guess this is why so many people become addicts of things which destroy themselves - because it closely imitates the sorts of things we really should be striving for.

I guess one needs to look at the bigger picture - their whole life, or even bigger, the lives of all those they touch.

Devil's Advocate

May I be the Devil's advocate and perhaps politically incorrect?

If someone's passion is playing poker and thus making bet's to make a living why is that intrinsically devoid of any value? Really? Why?

Lets use contrast for a second.

If someone builds multiple family dwellings because that is his/her passion, and then BETS that they can sell them for more than they cost him initially..... Is that too different?

I am sure you could jump and tell me the differences but I am sure you can also see similarities.

If some activity is satisfying and ones passion (and legal of course) I think it has intrinsic value. Maybe not to me or you, but to the person who has the passion. And that is what is important.

A life pursuing ones passion has value - and tons of it - to the pursuer. What others think may be useful, but secondary.

Otherwise.... composers would not compose, writers would not write, painters would not paint and by golly, poets would not gripe (sorry, don't much like poetry).

Let me add another one. Is lying on a high quality hammock dreaming up plans and being lazy, evolutionary?... To some that "get it", of course. To others, not likely...

Music, writing, poetry and hammocking are passions that bring joy. Whether they are evolutionary or not is a point of view. But they can be passions and if they are, they should be pursued.

If you have the time, I'd love to hear your reply!

-Devil's Advocate


I couldn't disagree more... as a professional stockmarket trader. Through this persuit, I have learnt and grown as a person hugely. Plus I now have the time to persue other interests, money to gift to worthy causes, and the ability to earn a living from a passion I compare to a range of other artistic persuits. In short, it floats my boat and has many other positive flow on effects, both directly through my donations and implicitly through me being a happy human being. I see nothing at all hollow about this and hope other people could experience the same degree of satisfaction.

Fred Gratzon

If you are the Devil's advocate, whose advocate am I?

I see a big difference between gambling in a game of chance and "gambling" on a business venture. In business, one is delivering a good or service to someone who wants that good or service. A contribution is being made. In a game of chance, there is nothing progressive. In business, the businessman's intelligence and creativity is challenged and he grows as a person. In gambling there is no personal growth. In fact, the gambler devolves.

Gambling is an addiction. Do not mistake passion with addiction. Gambling promotes decadence and greed. It damages health, ruins families, and chases away angels.

The whole idea of finding and following one's calling is personal evolution and fulfillment. Mother Nature did not put anyone on earth to be a gambler or alcoholic or crook or tobacco executive. Those are empty paths.

Juho Tunkelo

Purely as an observation, not having gambled myself, I have to say the effects of gambling on the people I know that have gone into gambling.. are devastating.

Even people who have gone on to make thousands per day have become just miserable. Whatever it is that creates that effect on people, I'd rather stay as far from it as possible.

Helping you

I have an idea! Why don’t we replace gold or the value of gold, (the material which backs American dollar) with help point? People would earn money by helping other, and society as a whole. For example if you went to school to be a dentist and performed free dental work on 100 patients, you would get paid, let see 100x$200-$300 per visit. Now that is a lot of help point. If you see enough patients you could buy a really fancy car that emits no pollutants and does not cause any killing in the Middle East. Take it from someone who is on the verge of declaring bankruptcy due to trying to afford school on his own. The U.S has a higher death rate for children under the age of 5 death compared to 35 developed nation, due to the poor health care system in this country. These innocent children deserve better! Obviously money isn’t happiness, and people who are born into poverty do not have the same odds at a “successful life” as those who come from wealthy families. Congratulation to all inconsiderate self centered “successful” citizens who have not given anything back to society. Greed!




Just stumbled upon this page and write with interest about the last (or previous comment) about HELP POINTS.
I had to laugh, however not in a funny way, because this has already been done in the UK and was legislated against, to the point NOW that we cannot receive goods in exchange of services performed.
The system was the B or barter. Cheque books where printed by the entrepreneur and hundred of businesses got involved.
Primarily this system was designed to circumvent taxes (MONEY) if you get my drift, and of course when this happens the IRS is going to get mightily miffed.
Money is THEE only means of CONTROL on this planet, and if you cannot comprehend this, ask anyone, other than us enlightened few if they could do without it. I have, and the argument (debate) that follows is convincing. Of course it would be wouldn't it, LOL.
The power of money is somewhat waining though and the power it has will fall, this means another currency is required, now, the powers that be know this and have started with the next currency, MEDICATION, don't believe me, then ask anyone what medication they are taking and you will be surprised to discover they have no idea.
Check for yourself, anytime, if you are not on ANY medication THINK AGAIN.
The next time you go shopping check what the food manufacturers are putting in your food!
OKay there are the preservatives, they make the food last longer on the shelves, however what about WHAT most of those preservatives do to you, hence more additives. Are you absolutely SURE that you do need IRON, vitamins and the like. SORRY I thought you had a choice as to wether you took medication!.
This industry is outstripping the financial markets and we are all being manipulated by medication that drives us to desire more.
What is it you LOVE to eat, ask yourself have you just been HAD!

This i dis agree with

Albert Freon



Exactly right! In life, it's a matter of choice. Whoever you become right now depends exactly on how you decide for that years ago. LIfe maybe difficult at times but there is always a way if we want to get something done.


this is a reality encoded in a pc. when someone chooses but the short cut to succss he is definitely giving himself headache in the future.


I agree with the devil above. If making money by trading or playing poker is your passion, if you enjoy the journey not just the destination, then there's nothing wrong with that at all.

Jack's Customized Fat Loss

success is achieving something you wanted to do and having a sense of fulfillment

- Jack Leak

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